From richard at imagecraft.com Mon Mar 9 11:22:36 2009 From: richard at imagecraft.com (Richard Man) Date: Mon Mar 9 23:29:00 2009 Subject: [Icc-430] 7.10 BETA0 with 430X > 64K support Message-ID: <200903100728.n2A7Sx4n005251@mail.imagecraft.com> http://www.imagecraft.com/pub/iccv7430_v710_beta0.exe V7.10 [ ADV/PRO only: Added basic 430X support for > 64K addressing. If you enable the "Enable 430X" checkbox under Project->Options->Target, the compiler will use CALLA/RETA for function calls. Literals and constants and interrupt handlers must reside in the lower 64K page, and this is the default unless you have large amount of such items and they overflow to the upper 64K page. There is currently no check when this happens. We will add the support later. You can check by doing View->MapFile to see where things are allocated. Currently, neither the ICC430IDE's flash downloader nor NoICE-430 can download to the upper 64K. To flash the full address range, you will need to use another flash downloader. We have good luck with the free LITE downloader from Elprotronic (http://www.elprotronic.com) ] TI header files, HIL.DLL and MSP430.DLL - Version 2.4.0.0 of the DLL and latest (Feb 2009) header file release from TI. // richard blog: On-line orders, support, and listservers available on web site. [ For technical support on ImageCraft products, please include all previous replies in your msgs. ] From jdurand at interstellar.com Tue Mar 10 08:19:30 2009 From: jdurand at interstellar.com (Jerry Durand) Date: Tue Mar 10 09:28:33 2009 Subject: [Icc-430] 7.10 BETA0 with 430X > 64K support In-Reply-To: <200903100728.n2A7Sx4n005251@mail.imagecraft.com> References: <200903100728.n2A7Sx4n005251@mail.imagecraft.com> Message-ID: <49B69312.2060008@interstellar.com> Richard Man wrote: > http://www.imagecraft.com/pub/iccv7430_v710_beta0.exe > Guess it's time to test the 32-bit flash loader I wrote for our field-upgradeable stuff. I wrote it with 16-bit code but it handles everything as 32-bit, just have to swap in the .x instructions and see what color the smoke is. :) Of course this means I'm running out of excuses for getting our enhanced lighting firmware done. -- Jerry Durand, Durand Interstellar, Inc. www.interstellar.com tel: +1 408 356-3886, USA toll free: 1 866 356-3886 Skype: jerrydurand From j_baraclough at zetnet.co.uk Tue Mar 10 10:34:08 2009 From: j_baraclough at zetnet.co.uk (John Baraclough) Date: Tue Mar 10 11:41:17 2009 Subject: [Icc-430] OT: Opto-isolation of RS485 signals at 250kbps Message-ID: <49B6B2A0.4080008@zetnet.co.uk> Hi All, This is a bit of a stab in the dark, but I hope that one of you guys can solve my problem. Last year I built a DMX controlled flicker box to drive a stage fire effect. It works well but I am now trying to incorporate a 6N137 opto-isolator between the RS485 receiver and the AVR mega8 to try and remove an occasional ground loop problem. I have tried several circuits from a variety DMX websites but can't get anything to work. I do have an isolated 5V supply for the RX485 receiver and input side of the 6N137, so it's not that. Any hints would be welcome. All the best for now, John From jdurand at interstellar.com Tue Mar 10 10:58:45 2009 From: jdurand at interstellar.com (Jerry Durand) Date: Tue Mar 10 12:07:35 2009 Subject: [Icc-430] OT: Opto-isolation of RS485 signals at 250kbps In-Reply-To: <49B6B2A0.4080008@zetnet.co.uk> References: <49B6B2A0.4080008@zetnet.co.uk> Message-ID: <49B6B865.8070404@interstellar.com> We design/build various DMX items and sell a couple retail. One problem I ran into with isolation is you'll find the speed specified for typical opto-isolators sounds good, but is really for a very small output signal that needs quite a bit a tweaking to make useful. You went on the right path choosing an isolator with built in detector. A few things that need to be noted (you already mentioned some): 1) When in doubt, refer to the ANSI specification (there's a 2008 update that I contributed a tiny bit to). 2) The DMX master has a grounded driver, each receiver should be floating. 3) You need an RS-485 receiver chip with floating power supply to drive the isolator. 4) Since your isolator has an open-collector output, you have to tweak the pullup and the LED drive current to get nice sharp rise and fall times. I prefer logic in, logic out isolators. 5) The DMX line MUST be terminated at the end furthest from the master. On RDM (bidirectional systems) the master MUST also terminate the line with an "active termination" (3 resistor arrangement). 6) Mind the timings and stop bits. 7) Remember that you may get up to around 800 frames per second and must cleanly ignore any you can't deal with in time. Many (most?) cheap dimmers fail on this point. Many people say you can only get about 40 frames per second, but that's FULL frames. The 2008 specification clarifies this. Feel free to ask me questions off the list, I'll help where I can but won't design your product for you. :) I'll be away from the computer for a bit today. John Baraclough wrote: > This is a bit of a stab in the dark, but I hope that one of you guys > can solve my problem. Last year I built a DMX controlled flicker box > to drive a stage fire effect. It works well but I am now trying to > incorporate a 6N137 opto-isolator between the RS485 receiver and the > AVR mega8 to try and remove an occasional ground loop problem. I have > tried several circuits from a variety DMX websites but can't get > anything to work. I do have an isolated 5V supply for the RX485 > receiver and input side of the 6N137, so it's not that. > > Any hints would be welcome. > > All the best for now, > John -- Jerry Durand, Durand Interstellar, Inc. www.interstellar.com tel: +1 408 356-3886, USA toll free: 1 866 356-3886 Skype: jerrydurand From j_baraclough at zetnet.co.uk Tue Mar 10 11:32:04 2009 From: j_baraclough at zetnet.co.uk (John Baraclough) Date: Tue Mar 10 12:39:11 2009 Subject: [Icc-430] OT: Opto-isolation of RS485 signals at 250kbps In-Reply-To: <49B6B865.8070404@interstellar.com> References: <49B6B2A0.4080008@zetnet.co.uk> <49B6B865.8070404@interstellar.com> Message-ID: <49B6C034.9060200@zetnet.co.uk> Hi Jerry, Thanks for the tips. This is just a hobby project so won't conflict with any commercial products. My copy of the ANSI spec dates back to 2006, so unfortunately doesn't include the new updates. The relevant section of the schematic can be found here: http://img.villagephotos.com/p/2006-5/1185528/DmxReceiver.jpg I've already had a suggestion that pin 7 should have a pull-up even though the spec says it doesn't need it. I try adding that first and see what happens. If that doesn't work I'll have a look for a high speed logic-in/logic-out isolator and try that. All the best for now, John Jerry Durand wrote: > We design/build various DMX items and sell a couple retail. One > problem I ran into with isolation is you'll find the speed specified > for typical opto-isolators sounds good, but is really for a very small > output signal that needs quite a bit a tweaking to make useful. > You went on the right path choosing an isolator with built in detector. > > A few things that need to be noted (you already mentioned some): > > 1) When in doubt, refer to the ANSI specification (there's a 2008 > update that I contributed a tiny bit to). > > 2) The DMX master has a grounded driver, each receiver should be > floating. > > 3) You need an RS-485 receiver chip with floating power supply to > drive the isolator. > > 4) Since your isolator has an open-collector output, you have to tweak > the pullup and the LED drive current to get nice sharp rise and fall > times. I prefer logic in, logic out isolators. > > 5) The DMX line MUST be terminated at the end furthest from the > master. On RDM (bidirectional systems) the master MUST also terminate > the line with an "active termination" (3 resistor arrangement). > > 6) Mind the timings and stop bits. > > 7) Remember that you may get up to around 800 frames per second and > must cleanly ignore any you can't deal with in time. Many (most?) > cheap dimmers fail on this point. Many people say you can only get > about 40 frames per second, but that's FULL frames. The 2008 > specification clarifies this. > > Feel free to ask me questions off the list, I'll help where I can but > won't design your product for you. :) > > I'll be away from the computer for a bit today. > From richard-lists at imagecraft.com Tue Mar 10 13:29:10 2009 From: richard-lists at imagecraft.com (Richard Man) Date: Wed Mar 11 01:35:37 2009 Subject: [Icc-430] 7.10 BETA0 with 430X > 64K support In-Reply-To: <49B69312.2060008@interstellar.com> References: <200903100728.n2A7Sx4n005251@mail.imagecraft.com> <49B69312.2060008@interstellar.com> Message-ID: <200903110935.n2B9ZbCs028674@mail.imagecraft.com> At 08:19 AM 3/10/2009, Jerry Durand wrote: >Richard Man wrote: > > http://www.imagecraft.com/pub/iccv7430_v710_beta0.exe > > >Guess it's time to test the 32-bit flash loader I wrote for our >field-upgradeable stuff. I wrote it with 16-bit code but it handles >everything as 32-bit, just have to swap in the .x instructions and see >what color the smoke is. :) Of course this means I'm running out of >excuses for getting our enhanced lighting firmware done. To force usage of the upper 64K, try const char junk[32000]; // size to fit Just make sure that __start ends up below 64K as that's the reset entry point. // richard From jdurand at interstellar.com Wed Mar 11 11:23:25 2009 From: jdurand at interstellar.com (Jerry Durand) Date: Wed Mar 11 12:32:30 2009 Subject: [Icc-430] OT: Opto-isolation of RS485 signals at 250kbps In-Reply-To: <49B6C034.9060200@zetnet.co.uk> References: <49B6B2A0.4080008@zetnet.co.uk> <49B6B865.8070404@interstellar.com> <49B6C034.9060200@zetnet.co.uk> Message-ID: <49B80FAD.5000800@interstellar.com> Sorry for the delay, every time I tried to sit down here I got dragged off. Yes, the EN pin should be tied to VCC. It's generally a bad idea to leave any input floating (unconnected). Back in the TTL days open inputs fairly reliably floated to a high state due to leakage currents. With modern parts the leakage is so small they can float almost anywhere and also don't like being in the middle. John Baraclough wrote: > Hi Jerry, > > Thanks for the tips. This is just a hobby project so won't conflict > with any commercial products. My copy of the ANSI spec dates back to > 2006, so unfortunately doesn't include the new updates. The relevant > section of the schematic can be found here: > > http://img.villagephotos.com/p/2006-5/1185528/DmxReceiver.jpg > > I've already had a suggestion that pin 7 should have a pull-up even > though the spec says it doesn't need it. I try adding that first and > see what happens. > > If that doesn't work I'll have a look for a high speed > logic-in/logic-out isolator and try that. > > All the best for now, > John > > > Jerry Durand wrote: >> We design/build various DMX items and sell a couple retail. One >> problem I ran into with isolation is you'll find the speed specified >> for typical opto-isolators sounds good, but is really for a very >> small output signal that needs quite a bit a tweaking to make useful. >> You went on the right path choosing an isolator with built in detector. >> >> A few things that need to be noted (you already mentioned some): >> >> 1) When in doubt, refer to the ANSI specification (there's a 2008 >> update that I contributed a tiny bit to). >> >> 2) The DMX master has a grounded driver, each receiver should be >> floating. >> >> 3) You need an RS-485 receiver chip with floating power supply to >> drive the isolator. >> >> 4) Since your isolator has an open-collector output, you have to >> tweak the pullup and the LED drive current to get nice sharp rise and >> fall times. I prefer logic in, logic out isolators. >> >> 5) The DMX line MUST be terminated at the end furthest from the >> master. On RDM (bidirectional systems) the master MUST also >> terminate the line with an "active termination" (3 resistor >> arrangement). >> >> 6) Mind the timings and stop bits. >> >> 7) Remember that you may get up to around 800 frames per second and >> must cleanly ignore any you can't deal with in time. Many (most?) >> cheap dimmers fail on this point. Many people say you can only get >> about 40 frames per second, but that's FULL frames. The 2008 >> specification clarifies this. >> >> Feel free to ask me questions off the list, I'll help where I can but >> won't design your product for you. :) >> >> I'll be away from the computer for a bit today. >> > > _______________________________________________ > Icc-430 mailing list > Icc-430@imagecraft.com > http://dragonsgate.net/mailman/listinfo/icc-430 > -- Jerry Durand, Durand Interstellar, Inc. www.interstellar.com tel: +1 408 356-3886, USA toll free: 1 866 356-3886 Skype: jerrydurand From richard at imagecraft.com Wed Mar 11 13:57:26 2009 From: richard at imagecraft.com (Richard Man) Date: Thu Mar 12 02:04:09 2009 Subject: [Icc-430] Competing with "Free" Software Message-ID: <200903121004.n2CA47DF053163@mail.imagecraft.com> I just wrote a blog entry of the subject, and I welcome any comments you may have. http://imagecraft.wordpress.com/2009/03/12/competing-with-free-software/ // richard From richard at imagecraft.com Sun Mar 22 07:58:10 2009 From: richard at imagecraft.com (Richard Man) Date: Sun Mar 22 20:05:24 2009 Subject: [Icc-430] RIP: Everett Greene, ICC Consultant Message-ID: <200903230405.n2N45MuX038093@mail.imagecraft.com> It's with a heavy heart that I am reporting the passing of a friend and a consultant to ImageCraft. Besides being a personal friend, Everett wrote all the command line simulators for the ImageCraft products, allowing fast testing of the compilers and he wrote all products' low level floating point libraries except for ARM and the Propeller. He will be missed. If you wish to send his family (addressing Ms. Greene is fine) a card, you can send it to me and I will forward it to the family. Richard Man ImageCraft 706 Colorado Ave Palo Alto, CA 94303 // richard blog: On-line orders, support, and listservers available on web site. [ For technical support on ImageCraft products, please include all previous replies in your msgs. ]